theotherwaldo
Well-known member
You talk to communists to find out what they're trying to do - so that you can counter it.
Talk, but never compromise.
Talk, but never compromise.
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Natural change that spontaneously develops from evolution in culture and society isn't the same as enforced change to effect specific desired political and ideological goals. In a democratic system the former is normal and acceptable but the latter is not unless effected by and through the existing constitutional system.Change is inevitable. ...
Truly. But I have to ask (risk of seeming un-conservative noted) who decides which change is natural and which is forced? Congress passed civil rights laws after it was determined that depriving certain people of certain rights was an old hat. Certain other people fought tooth-and-nail against allowing those groups anything resembling equal rights and still try to live in that past. In that regard, it was undoubtedly forced change that was naturally necessary.Natural change that spontaneously develops from evolution in culture and society isn't the same as enforced change to effect specific desired political and ideological goals. In a democratic system the former is normal and acceptable but the latter is not unless effected by and through the existing constitutional system.
Oh, that's an easy one. If someone has to decide, then it's not natural. No one decided on rock 'n roll supplanting swing as the default pop music genre, for example. It just happened.Truly. But I have to ask (risk of seeming un-conservative noted) who decides which change is natural and which is forced?
But there were countless critics who called rock and roll the "devil's music" and tried to get it banned from the airwaves. What changed? Nothing. The critics abandoned their crusade because their voices were drowned out by the majority.Oh, that's an easy one. If someone has to decide, then it's not natural. No one decided on rock 'n roll supplanting swing as the default pop music genre, for example. It just happened.
Are you are referring to their critics that were murdered or to the tyrants themselves that died of old age or by their own hand?Ummm, they died.
An amateur compared to Stalin and Mao.Only Hitler was far enough beyond the line to bring about his own demise.
What didn't they get away with?The rest were vile pieces of shit, but knew the boundaries of what they could get away with.
I'm referring to the fact that the dictators essentially retained power until they died, so nothing changed. In fact, they routinely slaughtered their critics to make sure nothing changed. They all got away with that, certainly. There's a difference between critics' voices being drowned out by the masses and critics being drowned by tyrants though.Are you are referring to their critics that were murdered or to the tyrants themselves that died of old age or by their own hand?
An amateur compared to Stalin and Mao.
What didn't they get away with?
Too many people see "debate" and think it means "argue until somone's proven right", then the other side has to be wrong. I'm not trying to win hearts and minds, and anyone here that is is only fooling themselves. We're all a bunch of different folks from different areas with different backgrounds. Obviously we're going to have differing opinions on where we need to be and how best to get there as a society.- I do it because I think it is important for Americans to engage in honest debate with each other across the red/blue divide
Well, at least I'm glad to know you're OK ... not dead, or something worse.This has been a pretty interesting thread! I have been away, helping the family farm during the summer - no cell service out here in the mountains. And while I was away I got called an idiot! ...
I think these are all examples of change naturally occurring, not changes decided upon and then forced upon the unwilling by authoritarian decree. Yes, civil rights took a long time, and encouraged with some action from the top, but it's still a change occurring mostly from the bottom up, not wholly from the top down....
Was the civil rights act natural or forced? Women's suffrage? Becoming independent of England? Oftentimes, necessary change isn't naturally occurring. It takes decisions being made, action being taken.
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No, here they just get canceled instead slaughtered.Obviously we don't silence critics here like the people you named did..
I can get on board with that. BUT, has any of that nonsense made you change the way you do anything in your life? I mean, yeah it's made me a bit wary...but overall I pretty much do stuff the same way I always have. I'm not a churchgoer, but I believe the 10 Commandments are a pretty decent guide for being a good person. I try to live by them every day. Everything else is just noise. Emphasis on "try"No, here they just get canceled instead slaughtered.
Not a thing.I can get on board with that. BUT, has any of that nonsense made you change the way you do anything in your life?
Ha! Thanks! I live to argue another day!Well, at least I'm glad to know you're OK ... not dead, or something worse.
And sometimes the bottom needs a swift kick to get moving.I think these are all examples of change naturally occurring, not changes decided upon and then forced upon the unwilling by authoritarian decree. Yes, civil rights took a long time, and encouraged with some action from the top, but it's still a change occurring mostly from the bottom up, not wholly from the top down.
What we need to do is stay calm, anticipate that third parties will register and post seditious material to justify shutting this site down, and REPORT THEM IMMEDIATELY.
Again, I know it feels like the Republic is lost. It may be. But for now, on this site, please for the love of God stay calm, speak rationally, and hope for .... better judgement from our leaders in the future.
The coming days and weeks (likely after the 20th) will be easier, but for now we need to be on the best possible behavior. Please. :)