Alec Killed a Guy

Gridley

New member
Interestingly, some of the speculation I previously posted from another sources, and was called on for no sources identified, is now being reported on the news as fact.
I think if the MSM is reporting it, we've proved it wasn't factual. ;-)

Seriously, some reporter might have picked it up from the same source you did, and not bothered fact-checking. That happens all the time. Your source might still be right, of course, but that it has been widely reported doesn't prove it is.

I, personally, have been on the site of a couple of things that have made local news. NOT ONCE has the story reported matched what I saw happen.
 

Gridley

New member
Pretty sure he gets the hunter biden treatment because he is a liberal, and as we have seen over and over, the laws for the left are different.
Still have hope an honest judge will sent him to prison, but most likely he will pay a few millions to the grieving family and get away with murder.
A lawyer I follow actually made the point that its highly unlikely he'll even be charged - not because he isn't guilty (the lawyer believes this would be a case of negligence that a first-year law student could win on its merits in a fair court - paraphrase of his words) but because the media is already making it the gun's fault.

Sadly, I think he's right.
 

roscoe

Well-known member
Translation; Having been nuked on every attempt to make point or insert a leftist spin, I don't want to think about it any more.
I am not sure anyone else has actually made a defensible point. Just emotional outbursts. This thread is almost the defining "I don't care about the facts, I just hate 'em" thread. And since there is so little actual hard information on this, folks here are just happy to spin away at the conjecture. "I know a lawyer who says this" or " I know a guy who says that" Ha Ha! Give me a break!

I may not be making points on the topic until actual hard information comes out, that doesn't mean I am not going to swat away your silliness.
 

Fine Figure of a Man

Well-known member
that doesn't mean I am not going to swat away your silliness.
Thank you sir may I have another?
I am not sure anyone else has actually made a defensible point.
Of course not, only you are capable of that.
it is nothing like you negligently killing someone with one of your firearms.
What about this brilliant point? We are anxiously waiting for an explanation that us simple folk can understand.
 

wiscoaster

Well-known member
....

I, personally, have been on the site of a couple of things that have made local news. NOT ONCE has the story reported matched what I saw happen.
That doesn't mean you were the only one who saw what actually happened and can relate the facts and just the facts, 'mam. Yes, you saw it, but you know the old law enforcement saw about five eye-witnesses to a crime giving five different stories.
 

Gridley

New member
That doesn't mean you were the only one who saw what actually happened and can relate the facts and just the facts, 'mam. Yes, you saw it, but you know the old law enforcement saw about five eye-witnesses to a crime giving five different stories.
True. On the other hand, when the news reports the exact opposite of what is possible ("the police called to report an accident...") I'm rather confident that the reporters are the ones who are wrong.
 

wiscoaster

Well-known member
... I'm rather confident that the reporters are the ones who are wrong.
... and sometimes exposed as to how they're making up the story as they go, such as the reporter saying the NASCAR crowd was chanting "Let's go Brandon!" when it was something entirely else they were really chanting (and could clearly be heard behind the interview dialogue).
 

roscoe

Well-known member
What about this brilliant point? We are anxiously waiting for an explanation that us simple folk can understand.
If you, as a private gun owner, accidentally shoot someone, then you are definitely at fault. The chain of custody and responsibility entirely lay with you. You loaded it, pointed it, and discharged it. All you.

If you are an actor, who doesn't get to touch the firearms until they are handed to you by an armorer, in an environment in which there is a licensed professional in charge of loading, clearing, and making safe real firearms and preparing prop guns, then the fault (primarily) lies with the armorer. We still don't know about the chain of custody on the set for those firearms, except that the assistant director told Baldwin that the gun was clear and safe to rehearse with.
 

sota

Member
If you, as a private gun owner, accidentally shoot someone, then you are definitely at fault. The chain of custody and responsibility entirely lay with you. You loaded it, pointed it, and discharged it. All you.

If you are an actor, who doesn't get to touch the firearms until they are handed to you by an armorer, in an environment in which there is a licensed professional in charge of loading, clearing, and making safe real firearms and preparing prop guns, then the fault (primarily) lies with the armorer. We still don't know about the chain of custody on the set for those firearms, except that the assistant director told Baldwin that the gun was clear and safe to rehearse with.

My question is, does he have the authority/skill-set to make that determination and decision.
My personal take, is there should be only ONE* person on any set who can make that call, and none of this "They told me so." bullshit either. Directly from the horse's mouth, or not at all.

* on a mega production, I could see dividing weapons into group to divide the clear/safe responsibility amongst them.
 

Fine Figure of a Man

Well-known member
If you are an actor, who doesn't get to touch the firearms until they are handed to you by an armorer, in an environment in which there is a licensed professional in charge of loading, clearing, and making safe real firearms and preparing prop guns, then the fault (primarily) lies with the armorer. We still don't know about the chain of custody on the set for those firearms, except that the assistant director told Baldwin that the gun was clear and safe to rehearse with.
If I am a thinking adult it does not matter if I am an actor, plumber, carpenter, accountant, nurse or Wikipedia professor. If someone hands me an "empty" gun I don't have to point it at someones chest and pull the trigger. If I do an the gun goes bang and kills the person, I have been negligent and probably guilty of manslaughter.
If it can be proven that the person pulling the trigger were a child, suffering from dementia, mentally challenged, insane or otherwise incompetent, the blame could be placed on the person that gave them the gun and or the persons caretakers.
 

wiscoaster

Well-known member
There had been two previous accidental discharges of the subject prop gun. Perhaps there was a fault with the gun. Or, iIf the gun was an SAA revolver type, we know what hair triggers some of those have. We've all seen in the movies how actors wave guns around with their fingers on the trigger (ie violation of safey rule). Baldwin was practicing a "cross draw", where the muzzle of the gun traverses a wide arc before it settles on the intended target. If he was cross-drawing the gun with his finger on the trigger, and if the gun was faulty, or if it had a hair trigger, it's easy to see how it could have discharged during a draw. IMO violation of a standard gun handling safety rule resulting in an inadvertant discharge is at least some degree of negligence or carelessness.
 

doubleh

Member
The police report is supposed to out tomorrow. I am going to wait to see what is said before commenting on this except to say it should never have happened.
 

Howland937

Active member
I have no facts to add, and I've avoided posting on this topic because of it. I will give my opinion now though, unpopular as it may be. This situation is not an "accident", it's negligence. Period. 100% avoidable if only the very basics of firearm safety were utilized. Doesn't make it suck less.(Edit to add)
The gun apparently functioned as it was designed to. It doesn't know what it's loaded with, or if in fact it's loaded at all. Human error can occur when we don't know better or we ignore what we know. Neither of those are accidents.

If Alec Baldwin deserves to be villainized, I'm all for attacking his hypocrisy: His willingness to profit from a role using the very things he regularly rails against. As an advocate, he has no more integrity than the countless female actors who had zero problems cashing the checks but cried "me too" years after filming nude scenes in every movie they made.
 
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Fine Figure of a Man

Well-known member
Alec, this is not the attorney for you.

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wiscoaster

Well-known member
He did have someone safe the gun before taking it, but still .... If I was a gun guy on the jury, this would still have knocked him down a few notches in my opinion.
 

wiscoaster

Well-known member
Forbes reports civil liability suit filed against Baldwin by the script supervisor, enumerating multiple violations of usual safety protocols, and one new (to me) allegation: pulling the trigger on the gun wasn't even in the script:

 
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